Patience is a virtue. Do virtues follow timelines?
A girl asks God for an answer, searches after it, and after a week she is given one.
Another girl asks God for an answer, searches after it for a year, and then gives up.
Hm, maybe the other one was given an answer and she just didn't like it. She may have been asking for something that wasn't in her best interest. Sometimes the real answer can be a hard pill to swallow. God/the cosmos needs understanding along with patience. The was probably poetic rhetoric, but I couldn't help myself. :p
I would say the first would be the patient one. 2 Peter 3:8 - "With the Lord a day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years like a day." So I would say its not the psuedo-linear passing of time that counts, rather that she waited as long as she needed to.
:) I agree. but weird, right? cause in my mind, patience is tied closely with time. If it is not tied in with time, what is patience... I have to rethink what it even is to have patience as a fruit of the Spirit.
Then she should take the answer for what it is and get on with her life. Happiness is to be happy, not to look for things to make one happy. So by being happy with the current circumstance, even if it is not what one wants, eventually better things will come. Either that or one will realize that the circumstance was not that bad to begin with.
pa·tient 1. Bearing or enduring pain, difficulty, provocation, or annoyance with calmness.
I disagree, I don't think patience has anything to do with being a Christian. I know hoards of impatient ones who continually pray and read the bible and then become overbearingly irritated with the situation at hand.
Patience has everything to do with practice of being calm in any given incident. Like when someone is doing something you consider annoying and yet you take your mind to another place. A place where there is nothing annoying and "annoy" is simply a word that has no power to put in in that "irritated" state.
It's control over one's emotions and mind, not reading of a book, faith, or belief in some religion. It's naive to believe that faith alone will give a person discipline.
I think what you're referring to is contentment in your first paragraph, and tolerance and peace in the latter ones.
I know some Christians who are unloving, as well as impatient. I also know of some strawberry plants I planted last year that, much to my dissapointment, refused to grow any strawberries. >:( darn things.
But despite knowing some obviously bad-tempered Christians and good-tempered mormon or atheists, I do not entirely credit their current temperment to who they claim to follow. For example, I don't know exactly how ill-tempered and impatient those people would be if they hadn't decided to follow Christ. you know how I like mathamtical metaphors... all we can see is the y value, the result; we don't know what x-value was put in the function in the first place. we can't see how things have changed. And if someone is not producing a fruit of the Spirit, is that a fault of Christ? Imagine if my strawberry plants had their choice to either bloom or just sit there. Part of the whole, free-will thing is we have the freedom to keep God at arm's length. We have the freedom to not produce fruit, and snub our purpose. It's not really being a follower of Christ at all, and it's not working with the Gardener, but we have the freedom to choose to be as useless as we like.
Now, you may resent this logic, and say "Are you saying anyone who doesn't read the Bible every day and put their hope in some religion, that that person is automatically useless?" Not necessarily. I believe God can use even people who don't realize they're being used for His purpose. I think anyone who chases after love, and guides their actions by love, will find themselves coming more and more in line with God. I think anyone who chases after love long enough finds themselves chasing after God, and will maybe realize that he's been searching after them too.
After all, what is love? (Head bobs to night at the roxbury) Some guided by the principle of "love" will go after someone they're not married to, and forever hurt the person they're married with. What is peace? Some guided by the principle of "peace" will refrain from warring with someone else over something they said that hurt them. That hurt may fester and later cause the friendship to fall apart, when just getting the argument out when it was small and could be handled might have saved the relationship. Peace and love are too ambiguous by our standards. There has to be something higher.
Now, my thing about patience was just a question of whether or not patience is direct ly related to time. And I find it puzzling that you say "she should just take the answer and be happy with it." because it implies that if you wait a long time for something, you must have missed it already. I think that may be true in some cases. But in mine, I don't think so. In fact, I think that my whole idea of patience = waiting, was wrong. That's what this post is about. I think it's important to be excellent at what I have in front of me today, rather than be "waiting", I need to realize that I'm working up to the answer, not waiting for it. I should be journeying towards something, not sitting placidly for something to occur so I can begin the journey. my recent motto is, "There's destination in every step of the journey." So really, time is less of a factor than I thought, because it's just a by-product of the distance needed before I can receive an answer when I need it and can carry it. Patience is strongly related to contentment and peace and endurance, as you alluded to. But I think there's another element there; I think patience also involves action, and stepping firmly on the answer before you have it. But, I'm not talking about Webster's definition of patience... so that may be why my view of it has frustrated you. I've defined it by what I know of God, and what He asks of his kids. I define love and peace by him also. And you have freedom to consider that naive.
It doesn't frustrate me, though I may have a different view on things. I don't think there is one religion that is right or one that is ultimately going to lead to heaven. Personally, I think the only thing that leads people to choose a religion is fear of Hell. Love, charity and kindness can be shown whether or not you choose religion.
I don't think that it's a matter of being naive. My opinion is it's a matter of comfort in creating a reality where "I'm definitely going to a good place when I die." Which, my reality is that I will go to a good place when I die whether I believe in that kind of a thing or not. I see religion as a big metaphor for both life philosophy and state of mind, I've never taken it literally.
I do seek love and I do seek to "Treat others as I would like to be treated". I just don't think that I will ever find what I'm looking for in religion. Who knows though, life takes us all through a crazy whirlwind. Rarely do we see ourselves as we are or where we're going. All I know is love conquers all.
I believe contentment and happiness are synonymous. "Happy - characterized by or indicative of pleasure, contentment, or joy: a happy mood; a happy frame of mind."
So sure you can call it contentment. Some people say that contentment is a choice whereas happiness is a feeling. That may be, but if you choose contentment the feeling happiness comes with it.
Hm, maybe the other one was given an answer and she just didn't like it. She may have been asking for something that wasn't in her best interest. Sometimes the real answer can be a hard pill to swallow. God/the cosmos needs understanding along with patience. The was probably poetic rhetoric, but I couldn't help myself. :p
ReplyDeletewell, assuming all statements above the question are accurate. what then?
ReplyDeleteI would say the first would be the patient one. 2 Peter 3:8 - "With the Lord a day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years like a day." So I would say its not the psuedo-linear passing of time that counts, rather that she waited as long as she needed to.
ReplyDelete:) I agree.
ReplyDeletebut weird, right?
cause in my mind, patience is tied closely with time.
If it is not tied in with time, what is patience... I have to rethink what it even is to have patience as a fruit of the Spirit.
Then she should take the answer for what it is and get on with her life. Happiness is to be happy, not to look for things to make one happy. So by being happy with the current circumstance, even if it is not what one wants, eventually better things will come. Either that or one will realize that the circumstance was not that bad to begin with.
ReplyDeletepa·tient
1. Bearing or enduring pain, difficulty, provocation, or annoyance with calmness.
I disagree, I don't think patience has anything to do with being a Christian. I know hoards of impatient ones who continually pray and read the bible and then become overbearingly irritated with the situation at hand.
Patience has everything to do with practice of being calm in any given incident. Like when someone is doing something you consider annoying and yet you take your mind to another place. A place where there is nothing annoying and "annoy" is simply a word that has no power to put in in that "irritated" state.
It's control over one's emotions and mind, not reading of a book, faith, or belief in some religion. It's naive to believe that faith alone will give a person discipline.
I think what you're referring to is contentment in your first paragraph, and tolerance and peace in the latter ones.
ReplyDeleteI know some Christians who are unloving, as well as impatient.
I also know of some strawberry plants I planted last year that, much to my dissapointment, refused to grow any strawberries. >:( darn things.
But despite knowing some obviously bad-tempered Christians and good-tempered mormon or atheists, I do not entirely credit their current temperment to who they claim to follow. For example, I don't know exactly how ill-tempered and impatient those people would be if they hadn't decided to follow Christ. you know how I like mathamtical metaphors... all we can see is the y value, the result; we don't know what x-value was put in the function in the first place. we can't see how things have changed. And if someone is not producing a fruit of the Spirit, is that a fault of Christ? Imagine if my strawberry plants had their choice to either bloom or just sit there. Part of the whole, free-will thing is we have the freedom to keep God at arm's length. We have the freedom to not produce fruit, and snub our purpose. It's not really being a follower of Christ at all, and it's not working with the Gardener, but we have the freedom to choose to be as useless as we like.
Now, you may resent this logic, and say "Are you saying anyone who doesn't read the Bible every day and put their hope in some religion, that that person is automatically useless?" Not necessarily. I believe God can use even people who don't realize they're being used for His purpose. I think anyone who chases after love, and guides their actions by love, will find themselves coming more and more in line with God. I think anyone who chases after love long enough finds themselves chasing after God, and will maybe realize that he's been searching after them too.
ReplyDeleteAfter all, what is love? (Head bobs to night at the roxbury) Some guided by the principle of "love" will go after someone they're not married to, and forever hurt the person they're married with. What is peace? Some guided by the principle of "peace" will refrain from warring with someone else over something they said that hurt them. That hurt may fester and later cause the friendship to fall apart, when just getting the argument out when it was small and could be handled might have saved the relationship.
Peace and love are too ambiguous by our standards. There has to be something higher.
Now, my thing about patience was just a question of whether or not patience is direct ly related to time. And I find it puzzling that you say "she should just take the answer and be happy with it." because it implies that if you wait a long time for something, you must have missed it already. I think that may be true in some cases. But in mine, I don't think so. In fact, I think that my whole idea of patience = waiting, was wrong. That's what this post is about. I think it's important to be excellent at what I have in front of me today, rather than be "waiting", I need to realize that I'm working up to the answer, not waiting for it. I should be journeying towards something, not sitting placidly for something to occur so I can begin the journey. my recent motto is, "There's destination in every step of the journey." So really, time is less of a factor than I thought, because it's just a by-product of the distance needed before I can receive an answer when I need it and can carry it. Patience is strongly related to contentment and peace and endurance, as you alluded to. But I think there's another element there; I think patience also involves action, and stepping firmly on the answer before you have it. But, I'm not talking about Webster's definition of patience... so that may be why my view of it has frustrated you. I've defined it by what I know of God, and what He asks of his kids. I define love and peace by him also. And you have freedom to consider that naive.
It doesn't frustrate me, though I may have a different view on things. I don't think there is one religion that is right or one that is ultimately going to lead to heaven. Personally, I think the only thing that leads people to choose a religion is fear of Hell. Love, charity and kindness can be shown whether or not you choose religion.
ReplyDeleteI don't think that it's a matter of being naive. My opinion is it's a matter of comfort in creating a reality where "I'm definitely going to a good place when I die." Which, my reality is that I will go to a good place when I die whether I believe in that kind of a thing or not. I see religion as a big metaphor for both life philosophy and state of mind, I've never taken it literally.
I do seek love and I do seek to "Treat others as I would like to be treated". I just don't think that I will ever find what I'm looking for in religion. Who knows though, life takes us all through a crazy whirlwind. Rarely do we see ourselves as we are or where we're going. All I know is love conquers all.
I believe contentment and happiness are synonymous. "Happy - characterized by or indicative of pleasure, contentment, or joy: a happy mood; a happy frame of mind."
So sure you can call it contentment. Some people say that contentment is a choice whereas happiness is a feeling. That may be, but if you choose contentment the feeling happiness comes with it.